Next Round of Drinks is on Cole

by JohnBowen

Our dear friend, frequent commenter, and #1 Jose Bautista fan Raul commented the other day:

“Cole Hamels will get an insane contract this winter. He probably wants 150 million. And that team will regret it.”

Man, was Raul way off, or what? Cole Hamels got an insane contract this summer. And he only got 144 million…with an option that could make it 160 million.

This contract makes Cole Hamels the second-most highly paid pitcher in baseball history, behind only Carsten Charles Sabathia.

There are a grand total of eight pitchers who have signed 100 million dollar deals:

CC Sabathia

Cole Hamels

Johan Santana

Barry Zito

Mike Hampton

Cliff Lee

Matt Cain

Kevin Brown

Of those pitchers, it’s clearly too early to tell on Hamels or Cain whether the contracts will be worth it.

Cliff Lee is in the second year of a 5-year deal. After a fairly dominant 2011, he’s been rather average in 2012, though not nearly bad enough to merit a 1-6 record.

Kevin Brown earned his money in the first two years of the deal, posting a 154 ERA+ and 1.030 WHIP in 482.1 innings as a Dodger. He made just 29 starts over the next two years before putting together a terrific age-38 season and getting shipped off to the Yankees to suck in his last two seasons. So, 3 great years, 4 bad, injury-marred ones…but that’s what you get when you sign a 34 year old man to a 7-year deal.

Johan Santana definitely earned his money in his first year with New York, leading the league in both innings pitched and ERA. He pitched well when healthy over the next couple seasons, but was limited to 25 and 29 starts before missing the entirety of the 2011 season. This season, he tossed the first ever Mets no-hitter, and has pitched poorly ever since, with batters hitting .305/.363/.575 against him.

Mike Hampton was a disaster in Colorado, plain and simple. Like former Astros teammate Darryl Kile before him, Hampton couldn’t adjust to the thin air and was traded to Atlanta after just two seasons, with the Rockies absorbing the brunt of the deal. The only good thing about Hampton’s time in Colorado was winning back-to-back silver sluggers, amassing an .881 OPS and 10 home runs in 152 PA’s.

Barry Zito was a disaster waiting to happen. He won the Cy Young in 2002 with good numbers, but in the last 3 years before signing his deal with the Giants, Zito had posted a 4.05 ERA, 1.330 WHIP, and 1.80 K/BB. Not horrendous numbers, but Brian Sabean should’ve known better than to pay him like a #1, when he was really more like a number 3. This deal has been colossally bad for the Giants, but until recently, they were paying Matt Cain peanuts (and they’re still paying Madison Bumgarner next to nothing) so it evens out.

CC Sabathia has earned his money for the Yankees, at least so far – especially when you consider that 20+ million a year doesn’t mean as much to the Yankees. But, for the sake of reference, the Yankees are paying him roughly Matt Cain’s contract after this season (5 years, 99 million dollars), which will run through his age-35 season. So, we’ll see. Since becoming a Yankee, Sabathia ranks 3rd in the league in IP, 5th in strikeouts, 7th in ERA+ and 2nd in wins.

Of these gentlemen, who will Hamels most resemble?

I like that he’s young (cross off Brown, Lee) and has pinpoint control (cross off Zito). He’s been hittable at times in his career, but actually placed second in the National League in hits/9 last season. He’s well on his way to another 200 inning, sub 3.30 ERA season, which would be his fourth in the last five seasons. He’s probably closest to Cain, and the two will begin their 100 million dollar adventures together next season.

So, my questions to the Dugout Central Community:

Having basically nailed his first prediction, will Raul be right about his second? Will the Phillies regret this deal?

And: Who will be better over the next 5-6 seasons, Cain or Hamels?

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164 Responses to “Next Round of Drinks is on Cole”

  1. Chuck Says:

    “Will the Phillies regret this deal?”

    Absolutely..unless he magically transforms himself into Steve Carlton.

    And: Who will be better over the next 5-6 seasons, Cain or Hamels?

    Hamels.

  2. Chuck Says:

    Here’s the question I have.

    Who are the 8 teams not on Cliff Lee’s no trade list, because guaranteed there are some phones ringing right now.

  3. Raul Says:

    The Phillies will regret it. Because that’s just way too much money to commit to 3-4 players when they need depth at several others.

    Cain will be better than Hamels for no other reason than Cain is more of a power pitcher and more likely to strike guys out. And Cain pitches in San Francisco, where fly balls go to die.

    I mean, look…the Mets aren’t really close to making a serious run. And the Marlins seem to be playing for 2017. I suppose the Phillies could be competitive. But I’m betting they’re looking at 3 or 4 years of 3rd place finishes.

    Sabathia probably isn’t worth that money but he is doing well. And maybe his decline is slowed should the Yankees find defensive replacements at the 3B and SS positions in the coming years.

  4. Raul Says:

    See. I think Cain will be better. Chuck and I don’t always agree.

  5. JohnBowen Says:

    “Who are the 8 teams not on Cliff Lee’s no trade list, because guaranteed there are some phones ringing right now.”

    I wouldn’t try to trade Cliff Lee right now if I’m Philly.

    This is the worst he’s pitched in five years.

    At his age, maybe he’s done being effective, in which case I’m wrong.

    You really want to sell this low on the guy? You’re minimizing your potential return.

    You’re gonna have to eat a huge chunk of his salary anyway; I would wait for at least the off-season and see if his numbers rebound any, thus upping his trade value.

    At this point, I really don’t think you’d get much for him.

  6. Chuck Says:

    The Phils now have four guys on their roster earning $95 million per season.

    Someone has to go.

    Personally, for me, I’d move Howard, but not sure how much value he has either.

  7. JohnBowen Says:

    Yeah, he’s probably impossible to move at this point.

  8. Chuck Says:

    Brewers will trade Randy Wolf “for nothing, as long as someone takes his contract”.

  9. JohnBowen Says:

    We might have to package Corey Hart to get another team to take on Randy Wolf.

  10. Chuck Says:

    OK, this is what bugs me about this trade stuff.

    Jayson Stark, who does some work for ESPN, says the Marlins are “95% certain” they won’t trade Josh Johnson.

    My buddy Tim Kurkjian, says “if the Rangers include 3B prospect Mike Olt, Johnson could be in a Rangers uniform by Friday”.

    Reminds me of the Mark Teixeira fiasco a couple of years ago when he went to the Angels.

  11. Brautigan Says:

    Any thoughts on Philly’s regrets on Ryan Howard?

    That contract alone might make Philly weak for several years to come.

  12. Raul Says:

    You can’t be too happy if you’re Ozzie Guillen.

    Half a season into your tenure and the team starts a fire sale.

  13. Chuck Says:

    No kidding…

    Everyone thinks the new Stadium would be a cash cow, and here we are just past the halfway point of the FIRST season and everyone is available except Stanton.

  14. Chuck Says:

    “Any thoughts on Philly’s regrets on Ryan Howard?”

    Nothing I can think of that doesn’t start with an “f” or end with a “k”.

  15. Chuck Says:

    AFL Managers and coaches announced.

    Phoenix: Manager Aaron Holbert, Hitting Coach Darnell Coles, Pitching Coach Charlie Corbell.

    Mesa Solar Sox: Rodney Linares, Brian Harper, Matt Herges.

    Scottsdale: Carlos Mendoza, Phil Clark, Mike Couchee.

    Peoria: Dusty Wathan, Alex Palaez, Lance Painter.

    Salt River: Matt Williams, Jon Nunnally, Mark Grater.

    Surprise: Jason Wood, Pitching Coach Jim Brower, Hitting Coach TBA.

  16. Mike Felber Says:

    I will catch up on the articles soon. Just want to say that this woman’s racist statement & support of a far right party should not have her booted from the Olympics team. You all know how I feel about hate & bias. Yet freedom of expression is important too. If she does not represent the Olympic ideal, should that not include the ideal of keeping freedom for even hateful speech? She tweeted:

    “With so many Africans in Greece…at least the West Nile mosquitoes will eat homemade food!!!”

  17. Chuck Says:

    Affiliations:

    Surprise: Rangers, Royals, Red Sox, Cardinals, Mets.

    Mesa: Orioles, Cubs, Tigers, Astros, Dodgers

    Phoenix: Braves, A’s, Marlins, Brewers, Rays

    Scottsdale: Indians, Angels, Yankees, Pirates, Giants

    Peoria: Mariners, Padres, Reds, Phillies, Twins

    Salt River: DBacks, White Sox, Rockies, Jays, Nationals

  18. Chuck Says:

    Opening Day October 9th, Rising Stars game November 3 in Salt River (not happy about that), Championship game November 17 in Scottsdale.

  19. Brautigan Says:

    THE Matt Williams? I know he still lives in Scottsdale, but I did not know he was coaching. I always wanted to ask him about his grandfather.

  20. Brautigan Says:

    Man, it is to hell and back getting to the new Talking Stick stadium. At least it is off of 101.

  21. Chuck Says:

    Braut..Yes, THE Matt Williams, and he’s been the DBacks third base coach for the last four years.

  22. Chuck Says:

    Talking Stick is a haul from my house, not quite as far as Mesa, though. THAT drive is a pain in the ass.

  23. Raul Says:

    Two Spring Trainings and one AFL and I didn’t see any of em.

    Moving back to NY on Saturday. Who knows if I’ll make this year’s AFL.

    Crappy timing.

  24. JohnBowen Says:

    The Phillies have swept the Brewers.

    KRod blew two saves.

    The bullpen blew leads of 6-3, 6-1, and 6-5.

    Historically bad.

  25. Bob Says:

    Raul, we should go out some evening in mid to late-August. My mom’s birthday is in early August, so I usually am not around for 3-4 days. Meet me at Port Authority, and I promise not to wear any Red Sox attire. No need for me to get my ass kicked by 100,000 Yankee fans. And Mike could come as well, although I think he prefers juice bars to other types of bars.
    Luckily for us, we have no such issues!!!

  26. Chuck Says:

    Good luck, Raul…sucks man.

    Find a job, or just transferring back where you were?

  27. Chuck Says:

    “And Mike could come as well, although I think he prefers juice bars to other types of bars.”

    Designated driver boys, although “other type of bars” would make me nervous.

  28. Raul Says:

    Lol. We’ll see, Bob.

    Should be easy.

    Chuck, no job but I have some connections and friends back east. I’m not too worried. I hated my job here and frankly the peace of mind has me so much happier lately. Cali is nice. I’d consider moving back someday. But now I’m heading back to be with family.

  29. Bob Says:

    LOL at 27. To be honest, I do not know the city that well, ( local hot spots, hooker hangouts etc) But I know Times Square and Central Park ( like who the fuck does not) So the knowledge those two have would come in handy to a schmuck like me.

  30. Chuck Says:

    “I hated my job here and frankly the peace of mind has me so much happier lately.”

    Sounds familiar, although with a child I need the insurance, so I can’t afford to walk away without a guarantee somewhere else.

  31. Raul Says:

    Chuck, that’s why I feel lucky. No wife and no kids makes this decision easier. And even the girl I was dating…we split up a few weeks ago so there’s little holding me here.

    Bob, for a guy who grew up in the suburbs, I know very little of NYC. But I’m sure we can find some hole to grab a drink or two.

  32. Chuck Says:

    I wouldn’t trade what I have, and I wouldn’t move back East for all the money in the world, but it would be nice to do something I like to do.

    But it’s all good, I’ll never have a retirement and will be working til I’m dead, so something will turn up.

    But being able to play golf or go to a ball game 365 days a year is priceless in itself, so I do the best I can to make things work.

  33. Raul Says:

    Lol.

    Someday I would love to have a little girl to raise and take care of.
    And yeah, being married would be nice. You get to come home to a beautiful woman who emasculates you, spends your money and gives you the occasional handjob twice a year.

    But for now, I’ll stay single a bit longer

  34. Chuck Says:

    You know why most marriages don’t last more than seven years?

    Because you end up doing the handjobs yourself.

    There are definite advantages to being married and being single…disadvantages too.

    Just like anything else, you get out of it what you put into it.

  35. Raul Says:

    Well said.

  36. Chuck Says:

    After getting off to a terrible start, Alex Gordon is now hitting .300. Production numbers are way down, but nice recovery.

  37. Raul Says:

    Definitely. Since may 1st he’s gotta be hitting like .360 or something.

  38. Raul Says:

    Credit to Gordon, his hitting coach and the Royals for sticking with him. Because two years ago his stock was in the toilet. If he came on the market now, every team would be calling.

  39. Chuck Says:

    Big game for Aaron Hicks today, 5-6, two doubles, homer, five runs.

    Love this kid.

    He ever figures out the batters box, he’s going to be a special player.

  40. Chuck Says:

    Duh…

    http://www.milb.com/milb/stats/stats.jsp?sid=milb&t=g_box&gid=2012_07_25_binaax_nbraax_1

  41. Raul Says:

    I thought Aaron Hicks was a pitcher

  42. Chuck Says:

    CF…

    Gordon’s 0-3 so far today..down to .296.

  43. Chuck Says:

    Bryce Harper better watch out..he’s only out-hitting Jesus Montero by nine points.

  44. Raul Says:

    Is Harper still the favorite for ROY?

  45. Chuck Says:

    For the handjob crowd, probably.

    Personally, I’d give it to Todd Frazier or Wade Miley at this point.

    If Anthony Rizzo gets hot he’ll have a shot, although he may have gotten called up too late..Harper has about fifty games on him.

  46. Chuck Says:

    Amongst NL rookies, Harper ranks fifth in OBP, SLG, OPS, 8th in avg, leads in SB’s, second in walks, third in K’s,

  47. Mike Felber Says:

    Raul, sounds like a good new start! You have my E-Mail, which has my pompous sounding art info & #, so call me anytime, I will fill you in on anything related to the city, web site notifications for free-cheap art & party events, what have you. i will be happy to meet you-& Bob-anytime. Port Authority is in my ‘hood, & near there is Times Square & my 9th Avenue, tons of great places for eats, pedestrian viewing, & drinks.

    I have no problem going to any bar, just do not care for alcohol. But I could suggest many. As for that “other type”-before my festival I joke I am turning over a new life, they tend to be more interested in art, & Hell’s Kitchen is more gay, so only apropos to have 1 of 5 or 6 parties there. Had an arrangement to do that last year, but needed to change the festival dates, did not realize it was to gay pride week, so they “got an offer they could not refuse”. But one near me has a big stage, big screen, plush furniture & separate back bar-would be great for my purposes of scheduling constant performances.

    But they have so much weekend biz. they do not need mine. Ah well, more gays in HK cannot hurt my chances w/the ladieieieies!

    Again, you two have been still losing weight, & at a moderate rate?

  48. JohnBowen Says:

    Who are the 3 guys ahead of Harper besides Frazier (in OBP, SLG, and OPS) ?

  49. JohnBowen Says:

    Yeah, I’m just seeing Frazier (who has been better, albeit in about 80 fewer PA’s) for OPS.

    Aoki’s been a pleasant surprise, but definitely not a top-3 guy for the award.

  50. Raul Says:

    I was down 12 pounds before I went on this insane drinking and eating binge in the weeks since quitting my job.

    I’ll lose it when I get to NY though because I won’t be spending any money and eating at home.

    The thing I need to watch out for is my friends. Because going back means they’ll want to get together for drinks. And beer and bar food really packs on the pounds. So I’ll need to be diligent.

  51. Raul Says:

    I could pick up Frazier on my fantasy team. But I don’t know who I’d drop

    Trevor Plouffe
    Lance Berkman
    Matt Joyce
    Dexter Fowler

  52. Mike Felber Says:

    Yah, here is a tip from a guy who is not less than 10% overweight-more on charts, but they do not account for muscle. Bring food with you. Saves money, & you will avoid unhealthy stuff & getting so hungry you will overeat.

    Find exercise you like, make the grains whole, keep protein high, plenty of varied fruits & veggies, minimize processed foods, refined flour, sugars.

    MYC Parks & recreation Dept.: membership in gyms here is cheap, you can use various centers, they have pools & good facilities for weights & tracks. And the outdoor pools in the summer? FREE.
    http://www.nycgovparks.org.

  53. JohnBowen Says:

    I guess it depends on what your team needs. I would drop Fowler, but if he’s your only speed guy…

  54. JohnBowen Says:

    Actually, Fowler is having a fine year, no thanks to his legs. 8 SB all year?

  55. Raul Says:

    I took fowler to start when he plays at home. Good splits.

    SB comes mainly from McCutchen and Andrus.

  56. Raul Says:

    It’s probably time for Josh Beckett to wear another uniform.

  57. Lefty33 Says:

    “Yet freedom of expression is important too.”

    Maybe so Mike but when you are a public figure in a setting like the Olympics you are entitled to nothing even close to free speech because it only has the potential to embarrass yourself and your country.

    She got exactly what she deserved and is an idiot for making a statement like that in a public forum.

  58. Patrick Says:

    “With so many Africans in Greece…at least the West Nile mosquitoes will eat homemade food!!!”

    An Olympian tweeted that and got booted off of the team?

    That is stupid and embarrassing but it sounds like she was making a poor attempt at humor. I think I would ask her to make a public apology and let her compete.

    Why ruin her life over it? We’ve all said/written stupid shit, kicking her off the team just magnifies her statement and now she will forever be remembered for one stupid, insensitive, immature remark.

    I don’t even know who the girl is, and maybe she is a real ass, but I feel sorry for her.

  59. JohnBowen Says:

    I’m not sure Mike knows what the first amendment actually says.

  60. Bob Says:

    Actually, the politicians of Boston and Chicago are pissing me off with them saying licenses will be harder for Chick-fill-a to get than other restaurants because the CEO slammed same-sex marriage.
    He says something they disagree with and he will have a harder time doing business in their state? Really open-minded. And Rahm Emanuel in Chicago needs to worry about the violence in his city, not some comments made by a CEO. None other than Cameron said their food was amazing about a month ago.

  61. Patrick Says:

    Rahm Emanuel is a class A asshole in every way. It used to be politically incorrect and illegal for anyone, much less elected officials to threaten fraud and blackmail against private citizens.

    I’m going to Chicago this weekend so if I see Rahm, I’ll tell him myself.

    Wedding, Cubs game, Brewers game, (Lol)lapollooza to see a bunch of bands I’ve never heard of, then back home.

  62. Bob Says:

    And Chicgo used to be a great city. I love the Shedd Aquarium. I hope it still is a great city. Been well over a decade ssince I have been there.

  63. Bob Says:

    Also, Patrick,I hope you enjoy your stay in Chicago

  64. Patrick Says:

    Thanks Bob! Chicago is still a great city in most ways and it’s wonderful for my high fat, red meat, cheese, bread and beer diet.

    We get to spend time with our daughter, who lives there, and most of our family is going to be at the wedding, so with baseball and rock n roll, I’m sure it will be great.

  65. Chuck Says:

    I’ve never been to Chicago except to change planes, and really have no desire. Obviously I would love to see a game at Wrigley, but I wouldn’t go just for that.

    I’m not much of a traveler, if there’s a reason to go somewhere that’s OK, but to just get in the car and drive to San Diego or LA for the hell of it is kinda dumb if you ask me.

  66. Bob Says:

    LOL at Patrick. After eating and drinking all that might want to then get a pack of Big Red gum. Juicy Fruit sounds too healthy.

  67. Chuck Says:

    Anyone making vacation plans for Phoenix for 2013 Spring Training..another carrot for you to consider.

    DBacks named host team for first round qualifying games in the World Baseball Classic. Games will be held at Talking Stick, with semi final and finals at Chase Field.

  68. Patrick Says:

    lol Bob, I don’t chew gum, I get my sugar content from the beer!

    Chuck, we’ve been traveling a lot since our kids moved out 9 years ago and I have to admit it’s losing some of it’s appeal, especially the drain on our bank acct. We’ve seen most of the country so there isn’t much new, but my wife likes to get out of Florida during the summer and this trip is mostly a family obligation.

    Now that she likes baseball we are trying to see as many stadiums as possible.

  69. Patrick Says:

    I’ve only been to Phoenix once. July 07′, I think it was 116 degrees. I’m sure it’s beautiful in the spring.

    That would be cool to go to the WBC. I’ll keep that in mind.

  70. Chuck Says:

    “Play-in” Round games are Sept 19th-23rd at Roger Dean Stadium in Jupiter, tickets on sale starting next Monday.

    Second round games next March in Miami at the Marlins new park.

  71. Chuck Says:

    My wife and I were married twelve years before our daughter was born, she was a travel agent and we’d get smokin’ deals on cruises and all-inclusives. I’ve been just about everywhere in the Caribbean and some of the hot spots in Mexico.

    Since she was born, it’s been Disneyland and Seaworld and stuff like that, and since I never got to do any of that stuff when I was a kid, it was awesome.

    I’d love to do a cruise again..Alaska and through the Panama Canal, either one, but I don’t do camping or fishing trips (dumb..waste of time..sorry, Bob), or drive two hours down to Tucson just to go outlet hopping (dumber).

  72. Brautigan Says:

    I could never live back east. It is too weird watching west coast games at 1:30 in the morning. Monday night football kicks off at 6 PM. We will still have water and beer when you all run out. Yeah, I’ll stay here on the West.

    I understand the family thing, fortunately, all my family are on the West Coast.

  73. Brautigan Says:

    “Yes, THE Matt Williams, and he’s been the DBacks third base coach for the last four years.”

    You can tell I haven’t been to spring training in years. I would know ALL the coaches, not just Matt Williams. I think I knew he was coaching, but it just slipped my mind.

  74. Raul Says:

    James Shields is due to be traded any day now

  75. Raul Says:

    Lol I understand, Braut.

    The west coast has its advantages, for sure.

  76. Patrick Says:

    I lived in LA for awhile back in 77′. I loved that the NFL started at 10AM, especially since I love to crack my first beer about the same time.

    I was just in LA a few weeks ago and even though the sky is a lot clearer then it was in the 70’s, the traffic would be too much for me to take every day. I’ve never been north of SF but it must be beautiful up where the Brawny Paper Towel Guy lives(Braut).

    Personally, the west coast of FL is the nicest place I’ve ever lived, as long as you can get a good job.

    Chuck, I put the WBC info on my calendar. Thanks.

  77. Chuck Says:

    My wife has a friend who lives in Clearwater and she wants to move there, or at least go check it out.

    I told her this time was the last, the next time I move is when the coroner’s van backs up the driveway, and if she insists, she can consider me retired.

    So the job market only applies to her…me, I might get a job vending beer at Clearwater Phillies games, but that’s it.

  78. Bob Says:

    My parents reside in Clearwater now. Although I have only been to Florida 3 times, and 2 of them were when I was 12 and fourteen.

  79. Brautigan Says:

    Seriously, this is the best time of year to live in Oregon. We have yet to hit 90 degrees, and we’ve been sitting around 80-85 the past couple of days.

    Now if we just had something higher than short season A ball……….

  80. Chuck Says:

    Rob Neyer lives in Portland..reason enough not to move there.

    I’d see him in line at Starbucks and end up in jail.

  81. Patrick Says:

    Clearwater is nice. A little congested getting in and out of it, but it’s beautiful. People talk about the summers being hot but it’s 86 and partly cloudy in my backyard right now. In December it will hit 30 degrees at night a few times but for the most part it’s 60-80 and sunny for all of fall, winter and spring.

    If you make it down, drop me a line and I’ll buy you a cheeseburger and a few cold ones!

  82. Bob Says:

    Patrick, thanks. Hope to take you up on the invite someday.

  83. Patrick Says:

    Sounds good Bob, I’ll be looking forward to it. Same goes for you Chuck!

  84. Bob Says:

    So Chuck, Neyer is a bigger ass than Law?

  85. Patrick Says:

    They’re Siamese Twins

  86. Patrick Says:

    Josh Reddick hits his 22nd HR and Tommy Milone is perfect thru 3 with 4 K’s.

    One thing I have to hand to Beane, he gets more than his share of good, young pitching. This kid is having a great rookie year, 9-6, 3.26, 1.17 whip

  87. Bob Says:

    LOL @ 85.

  88. Raul Says:

    Tommy Milone isn’t the name of a major league pitcher.

    It’s the name of a fuck-up in a Scorcese film. Or the name of a guy who should be making your pizza….like Marco Scutaro.

  89. Bob Says:

    J.P Arencibia has a broken right hand and will miss 6 weeks. Wonder if the Jays make a trade with d’Arnaud also injured.

  90. Patrick Says:

    Rocco Baldelli.

    Yan Gomes can catch a little and he’s currently on the 25 man roster as a hitter. He had huge numbers in the minors but nothing in the majors so far. I guess he’s not too good behind the plate though.

    Mathis usually starts fast when given an opportunity and then hit about .150 the rest of the way.

  91. Chuck Says:

    I have never met or had any personal interactions with Keith Law. I have SEEN him but have never met him.

    At the AFL Rising Stars a couple of years ago I walked into the press box and Joe DelGrippo was there talking with Law and Kevin Goldstein but didn’t know it was them until afterwards.

    They were standing outside the men’s room, I asked Joe if that’s how they normally meet people..lol.

    I have talked to Neyer on the phone..twice..both in SABR related conference calls..he’s a condescending a-hole.

    It’s been five years probably and long forgotten, so I might trip him or spill coffee on his shirt just out principle, but punching him out wouldn’t be worth the effort, because he’d still be an a-hole afterwards.

  92. Raul Says:

    The only thing I’ll say about Neyer is this:

    He’s been gone for like a year from ESPN.com and no one has noticed. At all.

  93. Chuck Says:

    He said Mickey Mantle would be a scrub today and Ty Cobb couldn’t make a roster.

    I think he relishes the fact most people consider him a total fuckwad.

  94. Chuck Says:

    Sooooooooooooo..

    MLBNetwork cancelled their sabermetric show “Clubhouse Confidential”.

    I guess once Brian Kenny’s five kids went back to school, no one was watching anymore.

  95. Mike Felber Says:

    I have known for decades just what the 1st amendment said John, ask or tell me directly if you have doubts. Which you have for no reason. I did not refer to the 1st amendment, I mentioned that she should have that freedom & the Olympic spirit. The letter of the law does not deny that they can boot her off the team.

    The case she can embarrass herself is irrelevant, unless you believe in highly controlling & punitive paternalism. Embarrass the nation, you can make that case. Though you are right Patrick, destroying someone’s life &/or dream is wrong. You can ask them to recant.

    That would almost certainly get her to do so. Though if she did not freedom of expression is important enough that I weould just officially condemn her statement & do not ban her.

  96. Bob Says:

    Mike, it is the letter of the Greek Law. The Greeks banned her, not this country, for good or for bad

  97. Patrick Says:

    @96 that sheds new light on it. She is their guest afterall.

    If she is some nice girl who thought she was making a joke, then it’s a shame.

    If she’s a spoiled racist brat, then good for Greece.

  98. Bob Says:

    She is a spoiled racist brat, from the little I have learned.

  99. Chuck Says:

    Are you guys talking about Lindsay Lohan again?

  100. Raul Says:

    So anyway, where is Greinke going?

  101. Chuck Says:

    “So anyway, where is Greinke going?”

    For what Milwaukee wants for him, he may not go anywhere.

    So, if we’re to believe Doug Melvin, and no reason not to, then the offer must be softening a bit.

    Just to be different, I’d say the Angels.

    for Garrett Richards, Peter Bourjos and Jean Segura.

  102. Bob Says:

    Actually, who is going first?

    1. Grienke
    2. Dempster
    3. Garza
    4. Beckett
    5. Lester
    6. One of those guys is leaving Boston, if not both.

  103. Mike Felber Says:

    Righ, I know she is Greek, should have clarified that they should follow our principles here. As we did there re: the basic ancient Democratic model. She IS racist, maybe spoiled, & I find her politics abominable. That does not mean banning her is the best way to handle it. She is not their spokesman, they should concern the statement, ask her to recant-hard to believe she would not-but not make being PC a condition of participation.

  104. Chuck Says:

    Lester’s not going anywhere.

    Beckett I could see, but Boston’s going to have to pick up some cash, because no one is going to part with more than a couple of mid-level prospects for him.

    I think the order you listed them is spot on, Bob.

  105. Raul Says:

    Lester stays. Beckett goes.

    Lester just sucks now.
    Beckett sucks and is a sour asshole.

  106. Chuck Says:

    Brewers asked the Rangers for Martin Perez and Jurickson Profar for Greinke.

    Got to hand it to Melvin, dude’s got some big cajones.

  107. Raul Says:

    LOL
    Not a chance, Melvin

  108. Chuck Says:

    Sweet!!!!!!!!!

    Just found out I’m going to the DBacks game tonite to see Matt Harvey’s debut..Alumni tickets..third row next to the visitor’s dugout on the OF side.

    I have to get up at 3:30am tomorrow so I’ll probably leave when Harvey gets pulled..but, unexpected.

  109. Raul Says:

    Pretty cool

  110. Patrick Says:

    Have fun Chuck!

  111. Mike Felber Says:

    Yah, try not to trip or slop up anyone you find too nerdy-lookin’!

  112. Brautigan Says:

    I like Neyer. I see him all the time and he is a nice guy, loves to talk baseball.

    You know, one of us.

  113. Raul Says:

    Easy with the “one of us” talk.

    It almost sounds like you’re saying he’s a goodfella.

  114. Raul Says:

    11 strikeouts for Matt Harvey in his debut

  115. Mike Felber Says:

    Or another “one of us”, which Chuck would happily assign b & w as “nerds”, those who all animus & damning eternal nerddom (sic) is assigned. But of course the stigmata rebounds upon the gratuitous j’accuser.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2G2X8QBt5m4

  116. Patrick Says:

    Mike, that link would be my version of what hell must be like.

    Harvey had those 11 K in 5.1 ip, Mets struck out 16, Dbacks made only 11 outs in the field.

    He’s the first player in modern baseball history (1900 to date) to strike out 10-or-more batters and collect at least two hits in his first major-league game.

    Harvey is the fourth pitcher since 1960 to strike out 11 or more batters without allowing a run in his major-league debut, joining Milwaukee’s Steve Woodward (July 28, 1997), Cleveland’s Luis Tiant (July 19, 1964) and San Francisco’s Juan Marichal (July 19, 1960).

    Despite the 16 K’s, Arizona is only 8th in the NL in K’s and 6th last year under Kirk Gibson. They were struck out the most in the majors the 2 years Hinch was at the helm, including a major league record 1529 in 2010.

  117. Chuck Says:

    I must be getting old, because I have no clue to what the point may be in #115.

    Harvey was ridiculous..

    I’ve always been on his bandwagon, since his days at UNC..one of my scouting contacts was a teammate and everytime I would talk to him (about Dustin Ackley) he would talk about Harvey, even though he was hurt at the time.

    He was right, I wish I knew what happened to him, I’d buy him a drink.

    I’ll take Harvey over Zack Wheeler any day of the week and twice on Sunday.

  118. Chuck Says:

    Oh, I get it now..

    Thankyou, Mike, for posting a video of the Felber Family Thanksgiving.

  119. Patrick Says:

    I’m glad you got to see Harvey’s debut. I think he’ll be more Marichal and Tiant then Steve Woodward. I have Bedard @ Dempster(maybe) on Monday and Lyle @ Fiers on Wednesday.

    John must be happy with Mike Fiers, huh? 59 ip, 58/13 K/BB ratio, 1.96 ERA and 1.06 whip.

    Bedard is 5-11 but is coming off a 2 hit 11 K tough luck loss. Imagine where the Pirates will be if Bedard comes around? They’ll be singing “we are family” come October again.

    On Mike’s video post, I only made it half way through because my blood pressure was soaring. What a nightmare. Throw me in the lake of fire, I don’t care, anything but that.

  120. Bob Says:

    Lake of fire. Ain’t that in Cleveland?

  121. Patrick Says:

    LOL Bob, yeah, that would make sense.

  122. Chuck Says:

    Cubs have scratched Dempster for Monday.

    Something must be pretty close on him, he’ll still start on Monday in all likelihood, just in a different uni.

  123. Patrick Says:

    I’ve been thinking that’s why they got Justin Germano from the Redsox, to take Dempsters spot.

  124. Bob Says:

    Actually, I thought that was why they took Michael Bowden from the Sox.

  125. Chuck Says:

    Man, Doug Melvin is holding a winning lottery ticket.

    He has two of the biggest money teams with two of the deepest farm systems fighting over Greinke.

    If he doesn’t walk away with a Ft. Knox return, he’s an idiot.

  126. Chuck Says:

    I just threw up on myself.,,,,

    “Sources have said the Yankees aren’t comfortable with Eric Chavez playing third everyday because of the previous history with his back, and have inquired about a replacement, with Chase Headley or Mark Reynolds…..”

    That’s where I stopped reading. My eyes blacked over and I may have lost consciousness for a minute.

  127. Chuck Says:

    Chase Headley for Dellin Betances and Brandon Laird?

    I think Trenton is at home, Delgrippo lives in Jersey, I’ll give him a call and check if he’s busy today, so he can drive those two pretenders to the airport.

  128. Raul Says:

    Mark Reynolds and Derek Jeter on the left side of an infield.

    Are you trying to give John an aneurysm?

  129. John Says:

    Lol Axford and KRod have taken care of my aneurisms for the year.

  130. Chuck Says:

    Hey Raul..good luck on the move, man..driving or flying?

  131. Raul Says:

    Axford, I think, started off 2011 with a blown save…or three. Not sure. But I recall making a point not to get him on my fantasy team, even after that small sample size.

    I think he went on to have a great 2011. But I’ll use this year’s troubles as justification to stay away.

  132. Chuck Says:

    If the Brewers trade Aramis, their starting infield will be:

    Corey Hart, 1B
    Rickie Weeks, 2B
    Edwin Maysonet, SS
    Cody Ransom, 3B

    John will be banned forever from using the words “infield and defense” in the same sentence.

  133. Raul Says:

    Thanks Chuck.

    I’m flying tonight. Usually I try to leave out of Burbank because it’s 10 mins from my house. But the flights were too pricey so I have to go out of LAX.

    So yeah. Friday night. Flight out of LA. It might take 2 hours to friggin get there.
    Supposed to be raining in NY. First time I will see rain all year.

    I was re-reading Bourdain’s “Kitchen Confidential” over the last few days since I had to ship my computer and sold my tv and had no entertainment. So I’m really looking forward to some great food when I go back.

    Maybe not fine French cuisine…frankly I never did know half the food in the book. But at least I’ll have a decent slice of pepperoni.

  134. JohnBowen Says:

    LOL – did you see that team last year?

    Prince Fielder, 1B
    Rickie Weeks, 2B
    Casey McGehee, 3B
    Yuniesky Betancourt, SS

    Of that group, Prince Fielder was the best at fielding his position.

    @131, Axford blew 2 of his first 4 save opportunities in 2011, including a 3-inning one on opening day… and proceeded to basically dominate the rest of the year until game 5 of the NLDS.

    But you know. That’s 70 IP.

  135. Chuck Says:

    The only thing French about Bourdain is his name..he owns a friggin’ Italian restaurant.

    Loved “Kitchen Confidential”…talking about walking down memory lane.

    That book is kind of like the restaurant version of “Ball Four”..today it’s no big deal, 20 years ago it was a holy shit moment.

  136. Chuck Says:

    Sunday is “National Lasagna Day”..heading to the butcher after work for some fresh sausage.

  137. Raul Says:

    That sounds food. Sunday is a good day for that. Then pass out in the afternoon

  138. Chuck Says:

    Moving cross country sucks..especially driving a UHaul. Shipping your stuff and flying is the way to go.

  139. Raul Says:

    I don’t have that many things. I sold everything and shipped three large Home Depot boxes and a smaller box on Tuesday. With me on the plane will be a carry-on and two checked suitcases. And the carry-on could be divided between the suitcases but I don’t want to risk going over the weight limit.

    I wouldn’t want to drive. What does u-haul charge? 50 cents a mile? Something like that. It would be a few grand on that and gas alone.

    In a way I think a cross country drive can be fun and cool. I remember driving from NY to Florida as a kid. I’ll tell ya tho…the back of that station wagon smelled something awful by the time we got there.

  140. Chuck Says:

    When we moved 20 years ago it was close to five, six grand if I remember..truck..car trailer..insurance.

  141. Raul Says:

    You could be right. I forgot that you would also likely be driving your car from ny to az. Or your wife would. So that’s like double the mileage. Plus there are the costs of eating and hotels on the way. And if you stop some place to do touristy things…jeez, you could get up to $10,000 if you aren’t careful.

  142. Chuck Says:

    We towed the car, so I saved the money there but I had never driven a truck before, much less towed a trailer, so I was scared shitless for a week.

    I wouldn’t drive in the dark, I wouldn’t find a hotel that wasnt’ within eye distance of the freeway, and I wouldn’t get gas at any place that required me to back up.

  143. Raul Says:

    Jim Bowden suggested the following trade:

    Minnesota Twins send Francisco Liriano, Jared Burton, Justin Morneau, Josh Willingham and cash to the San Francisco Giants for Brandon Belt, Kyle Crick, Mike Kickham and Heath Hembree

    I am stunned this man was a general manager for a professional baseball team.

  144. Bob Says:

    Garza will be out another week due to fluid build-up in his triceps.

  145. Chuck Says:

    “I am stunned this man was a general manager for a professional baseball team.”

    I am stunned someone is paying him to talk about baseball.

    How the heck can you get a fluid build up in a muscle?

  146. Raul Says:

    Maybe they wrote triceps and meant knee? Lol

  147. Bob Says:

    Aas the Cubs medical staff. Not my diagnosis.

  148. Bob Says:

    I meant ask the Cubs medical staff.

  149. Bob Says:

    To be fair it says biceps area. My fault.

  150. Chuck Says:

    I think you answered it..Cubs medical staff…to save money, Theo hired Doogie Howser.

  151. Raul Says:

    The only time Bob has fluid build up in his arm is when someone spills a beer on him.

  152. Chuck Says:

    Dear Doug Melvin,

    We’d love to take Mr. Greinke off your hands, but I have a problem in that general area you may be able to help me with.

    In looking at things, I think Mr. Vernon Wells would look outfuckingstanding in a Brewers uniform.

    Interested? Give me a call.

    Not interested? I have Theo on line two and Andrew Friedman on line three.

    Hope to hear from you soon,

    XXOOXXOO

    Arte Moreno.

  153. Raul Says:

    You know what Jim Bowden suggested for Greinke?

    Milwaukee Brewers send Zack Greinke to Los Angeles Angels for Jean Segura and Garrett Richards

  154. Raul Says:

    AJ Burnett is 12-3 with a 3.52 ERA.

    Must be nice to get out of the American League.

  155. Brautigan Says:

    Must be nice to get out of New York. Just ask Javier Vazquez.

  156. Bob Says:

    @ 151. Or when I spill liquor on myself.

  157. Chuck Says:

    I love this infatuation with Pitch/FX..do any of these statheads actually know where the data comes from?

    I’m looking at The play account of Matt Harvey’s game yesterday, and in the 5th inning he is credited with throwing a 79 mph slider to Justin Upton. He was also credited with sliders at 83, 84, 84, 83, 83, 83, 80 and 84.

    Harvey threw 106 pitches, so that makes, at minimum, 8% of the data wrong. Add to the fact you have to make the appropriate corrections, that doubles the total, now we’re at 16%.

    Sigh…

  158. Chuck Says:

    Happy Birthday….

    Max Scherzer, Alex Rodriguez, Shea Hillenbrand (same day in 1975), Enrique Wilson, Len “Perfect Game” Barker, Brian Kingman, Bump Wills, Rich Dauer, Larry Biittner, Jack Hiatt, Don Lock (cannon for an arm), Johnny Kucks, Ray Boone, HOF manager Leo Durocher, Benny Bengough, Rube Walberg, HOFer Joe Tinker (and his lifetime .308 OBP).

  159. Raul Says:

    I don’t know who pitch/fx is for.

    I mean I wouldn’t ever look at it.
    You can tell if a guy has good velocity by looking at him. And if you need a hard number, there’s the gun.
    As far as movement and break, that’s something you tell from standing near the batter’s box or get from the catcher. Plus you can tell how good or deceptive the pitcher is by how comfortable a batter is

  160. John Says:

    I think the idea (and I’m not wild about it either) is to evaluate the effectiveness of pitches from a pitcher, as well as the frequency with which he throws them.

    ESPN was showing that James Shields has been using his fastball a lot less often this season, while also showing that the OPS-against his fastball had gone up like 150 points since last season (chicken or the egg?). Anyway, that’s one possible reason (according to ESPN, why is ERA is up 1.70 since last year.

    I dunno – if the system can’t differentiate effectively enough, it seems to be that you could be missing/ignoring lots of data.

  161. Raul Says:

    If you’re facing the Angels this Autumn as they march out Jered Weaver, Zack Greinke and Dan Haren, consider yourself fucked.

  162. Raul Says:

    Pardon me, I didn’t mean Haren. I meant that lefty scumbag from Texas. But I can’t recall his name right now.

  163. Mike Felber Says:

    Lol, Good one Chuck. And I just watched the Opening ceremonies in NJ w/Sister’s family. Nah, I am the freakiest one there, & even I am not physically odd.

    Patrick, they actually traveled around the world to find sideshow attraction for the ‘32 movie Freaks. If you did not like that scene, stay away from the ending & what they did to the blond & her BF, the strong man. But the real point was that they were cruel & without human feeling, those two, they were the real freaks.

    Welcome Raul. Just write or call me if I can help with anything. From events to possible NYC work opportunities. There are public resources for same with the Dept. of Labor & NYCPL that most do not know about.

  164. Bob Says:

    @ 161. C.J. Wilson

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